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Post by Gail on Dec 10, 2010 21:32:51 GMT -5
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Post by elucas on Dec 10, 2010 22:35:00 GMT -5
Rabies is 100% fatal. There are no treatments... no cures... and it can infect all mamals (including humans). |
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Post by Cassie on Dec 10, 2010 23:53:12 GMT -5
I wonder how many people here run titers before vaccinating?
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Nellie
Titled Dobermann
Member - Service Dogs of America
Posts: 186
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Post by Nellie on Dec 11, 2010 8:44:40 GMT -5
Rabies is 100% fatal. There are no treatments... no cures... and it can infect all mamals (including humans). The point here is that we are over doing it with the vaccines. Yes, we need to vaccinate but, with the first 'booster' shot most dogs are set for life. Please, titer to see if an additional booster is needed. This goes for all vaccinations. Nellie |
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Post by krivers on Dec 11, 2010 8:47:18 GMT -5
Interesting read - however I would offer one word of caution as to the source of the materials being presented in this particular article. There is one particular tumor to worry about when vaccinating cats (or giving them any subcutaneous injections), however it is quite rare (although locally invasive) and as Erynn pointed out - the risk of rabies is usually outweighed to be greater and thus vaccines are elected. Not to mention that there are areas in which administering the rabies vaccine to dogs (&cats) is the law due to the human health risk. In terms of the vaccines themselves - there are formulations of the vaccine that seem to be 'safer' due to the adjuvant used. This is a link to a site that provides information written by specialists on many different topics as well. www.veterinarypartner.com/Content.plx?P=A&S=0&C=0&A=526After looking into Dr. Blake (author of the article on the initial post) I find no listing of the origin of DR. in front of his name (IE. PhD, vet, etc). Hopefully he has had practical experience in the field and is making these recommendations based on that. He also suggests that micro-chipping is not that safe (for the same reason as vaccinating - potential tumor formation). After reading a bit through the site, I feel like it is good resource with valuable information in most areas- hopefully most people will talk to a veterinarian they trust and make an informed decision as to what is the best fit for them and their pets. (IE. titres, multi-year vaccines, etc)  |
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Post by elucas on Dec 11, 2010 11:30:51 GMT -5
Rabies is 100% fatal. There are no treatments... no cures... and it can infect all mamals (including humans). The point here is that we are over doing it with the vaccines. Yes, we need to vaccinate but, with the first 'booster' shot most dogs are set for life. Please, titer to see if an additional booster is needed. This goes for all vaccinations. Nellie I haven't seen this research. Can you point me in the right direction? |
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Post by sonterra on Dec 11, 2010 12:57:18 GMT -5
There is one particular tumor to worry about when vaccinating cats (or giving them any subcutaneous injections), however it is quite rare (although locally invasive) and as Erynn pointed out - the risk of rabies is usually outweighed to be greater and thus vaccines are elected. I would like to point out that the tumor is not as rare as one would think, as the occurance of the tumor in cats led to the changing of the injection site in all animals (so that a limb could be amputated if neccessary). For vets to do this, would take more than a "rare" occurance. To me the change acknowledges the fact that they know and have known there are issues with the vaccine for many many years. Tamara McIntosh |
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Post by Gail on Dec 11, 2010 13:59:44 GMT -5
Cancer causes many deaths in our dobes, second only to DCM. I think it wise for dog owners to do titers and then make the decision if you need to give a booster based on the titer level. I am not advocating for NO vaccinations, but I am advocating that people do not just blindly continue to vaccinate when it is not needed and in many cases over vaccination can lead to cancer. I also have a link to an article, that speaks about the adjuvant being contaminated which inturn can affect the heart. We are all very committed to educating ourselves on the genetics that are associated with DCM, but I feel we are not as committed to educating ourselves on the "ENVIRONMENTAL" causes of DCM here is another link report in depth the serious side effects found after vaccination. naturalrearing.com/coda/a_science_of_vaccine_damage.htmlThe statement below was a real eye opener! "Our ongoing studies of dogs show that following routine vaccination, there is a significant rise in the level of antibodies dogs produce against their own tissues. Some of these antibodies have been shown to target the thyroid gland, connective tissue such as that found in the valves of the heart, red blood cells, DNA, etc. I do believe that the heart conditions in Cavalier King Charles Spaniels could be the end result of repeated immunisations by vaccines containing tissue culture contaminants that cause a progressive immune response directed at connective tissue in the heart valves. The clinical manifestations would be more pronounced in dogs that have a genetic predisposition [although] the findings should be generally applicable to all dogs regardless of their breed." After reading the above statement one has to ask if the thryoid issues we face with our dobermans if a direct result of vaccinations. And could the overuse of vaccines be the cause of Ventricular Afibluation type of DCM (valve impairment) be the cause of the rise of DCM cases? Definitely something to think about. |
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Post by krivers on Dec 12, 2010 11:44:44 GMT -5
I would like to point out that the tumor is not as rare as one would think, as the occurance of the tumor in cats led to the changing of the injection site in all animals (so that a limb could be amputated if neccessary). For vets to do this, would take more than a "rare" occurance. To me the change acknowledges the fact that they know and have known there are issues with the vaccine for many many years.
Tamara McIntosh[/quote]
Good point - I think the current data in the literature suggests an occurrence rate of 1/10000. (not sure if studies have been done with the new Purevax for cats that has been released) - but the the hope with the new vaccine is that it would further shrink that ratio.
(Remember that purpose of the vaccine is to stimulate the immune system to create a protective state against the pathogen of interest, all the while causing no other adverse effects - with that said, unfortunately they can/do still happen.)
In my 2 years and change practicing at a fairly busy clinic, I have seen one cat come in with one of these fibrosarcomas and it was an incidental finding because the cat had come in with another issue. Perhaps we have been fairly lucky or time is a factor.
This is a tumour I would not wish on any cat and their family, however the answer is not as simple as not vaccinating (for rabies anyways) due to the fatal repercussions of infection by the rabies virus on any mammal (incl. humans). If someone had the perfect solution, I would hope that they would share it so that all could benefit - both owners and their cats.
Because the tumours tend to be nasty, locally aggressive and require advanced surgical techniques for removal, it is prudent to vaccinate on an area that if they do happen - there is an increased chance for a complete excision.
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